Snakeoil Music server & Snakeoil its own endpoint
#1
As I found that in my setup, even my fanless NUC for ROON is highly modified with a good LPS directly attached to it, I found after using a pi as bridge https://www.snakeoil-os.net/forums/threa...ml#pid6802, the sound is much different (to my ear is much better in those aspects I understand).  In my understanding that, Roon bridge collects data from server and stored several seconds of music data as buffer in ram, and then output to the USB or whatever digital output.  As the process is rather straight forward and with such data buffer in ram, then the jitter and latency will be the lowest value in that piece of hardware (ie. pi in this topic).

I wonder, can Snakeoil OS do the same thing?  I mean, e.g. Snakeoil music server (whatever the player is), and then a Snakeoil bridge.  Of course, maybe it can be set as an option to enable/disable, to minimize the background process in the host. Big Grin
Reply

#2
Do not understand the question. bridge as in a network bridge? or as a endpoint playback device (i.e. just play music?), in the line of the NAA bridge?

If the latter technically it can already be done. If using LMS as the media server you can setup Snakeoil as just a player (i.e. runs only Squeezelite).

Similarly you can do so with MPD, with upmpdcli queuing up a playlist from a remote source. 

This is kind of what I'm doing now. I have LMS running in a LXC container in something called a Promox cluster. Then my player just runs Squeezelite.
Snakeoil Operating System - Music, your way!
Reply

#3
(18-Nov-2023, 09:00 AM)agent_kith Wrote: <snip> 

This is kind of what I'm doing now. I have LMS running in a LXC container in something called a Promox cluster. Then my player just runs Squeezelite.

I'm surprised all those processes running on your server don't mess up your SQ. Apparently not. Or you wouldn't do it.  Cool
Reply

#4
(18-Nov-2023, 08:35 PM)uglymusic Wrote: I'm surprised all those processes running on your server don't mess up your SQ. Apparently not. Or you wouldn't do it.  Cool
It's more a compromise. Having LMS running on the server means it will be running 24/7, and I still have access to my music when my music computer isn't turned on.

Having said that, in future as I get more and more Raspberry Pi 5s, I might move one of the Pi 4 to be a dedicated LMS unit.
Snakeoil Operating System - Music, your way!
Reply

#5
(18-Nov-2023, 09:00 AM)agent_kith Wrote: Do not understand the question. bridge as in a network bridge? or as a endpoint playback device (i.e. just play music?), in the line of the NAA bridge?

If the latter technically it can already be done. If using LMS as the media server you can setup Snakeoil as just a player (i.e. runs only Squeezelite).

Similarly you can do so with MPD, with upmpdcli queuing up a playlist from a remote source. 

This is kind of what I'm doing now. I have LMS running in a LXC container in something called a Promox cluster. Then my player just runs Squeezelite.

I'm sorry for my poor wording.  I mean endpoint playback device.  I'm thinking is it feasible (theoretically) that, Snakeoil and MPD (also convolution dsp in future?) run in a machine, and then output the processed data to an endpoint (e.g. Raspberry Pi) for USB output or whatever digital format. 

I suspect that,
1) as the kernel workload for such pi endpoint is very specific, and tiny, the system will be more efficient and the latency will be at minimum level;
2) the workload for endpoint is so much simpler, mainly receiving data from network, and then buffer it in local memory, and then output digitally, that reduce related jitter and latency to minimum;
3) LPS for Pi is much simpler, easier and economic in comparing to a NUC or other form of PC;
4) With an endpoint, probably we can decrease the hardware requirement for the music server (e.g. modified NUC, or other fanless PC), that make the CAS much more cost effective;
5) Hopefully, eventually, such combo makes CAS more affordable, simpler, but eventually the sound quality is even better and enjoyable than before. Smile
Reply

#6
(19-Nov-2023, 10:50 AM)agent_kith Wrote:
(18-Nov-2023, 08:35 PM)uglymusic Wrote: I'm surprised all those processes running on your server don't mess up your SQ. Apparently not. Or you wouldn't do it.  Cool
It's more a compromise. Having LMS running on the server means it will be running 24/7, and I still have access to my music when my music computer isn't turned on.

Having said that, in future as I get more and more Raspberry Pi 5s, I might move one of the Pi 4 to be a dedicated LMS unit.

Yeah. Everything's a compromise, isn't it? Without infinite funds or infinite time.

My RPi 5, which didn't arrive yesterday as promised, is destined for server duties.
Reply

#7
It has taken some time, but I finally got to test the difference between running LMS and Squeezelite on 1 box versus running LMS on 1 box and Squeezelite on a second box.  Running on 2 boxes produced a noticeable quieter background, with better detail.  Thank you @hkphantomgtr for suggesting this.

For reference, LMS 8.4.1 running on my Mercury V2 Streamer (CM4) with Bookworm and Squeezelite on Intel NUC with Ubuntu 22.04.3 LTS.  Both running SO 1.3 and with my own real time kernels.  Before someone asks, the more powerful NUC sounds better than the Mercury, hence it is the end point.
[-] The following 1 user Likes Snoopy8's post:
  • hkphantomgtr
Reply

#8
(16-Feb-2024, 08:28 PM)Snoopy8 Wrote: It has taken some time, but I finally got to test the difference between running LMS and Squeezelite on 1 box versus running LMS on 1 box and Squeezelite on a second box.  Running on 2 boxes produced a noticeable quieter background, with better detail.  Thank you @hkphantomgtr for suggesting this.

For reference, LMS 8.4.1 running on my Mercury V2 Streamer (CM4) with Bookworm and Squeezelite on Intel NUC with Ubuntu 22.04.3 LTS.  Both running SO 1.3 and with my own real time kernels.  Before someone asks, the more powerful NUC sounds better than the Mercury, hence it is the end point.

Did you try the effect of different clocksources in the endpoint NUC, ie TSC vs Hpet?
Reply

#9
(17-Feb-2024, 11:01 AM)hkphantomgtr Wrote: Did you try the effect of different clocksources in the endpoint NUC, ie TSC vs Hpet?
Do not have Hpet on my new NUC (a different version called Element). Tried Hpet on old NUC a few years ago, and did not like it.
Reply



Bookmarks

Possibly Related Threads…
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Working on new Snakeoil release - 1.3.x (Codename Measurements) agent_kith 42 5,695 19-Nov-2023, 10:53 AM
Last Post: agent_kith
  Make SnakeOil install much easier Snoopy8 5 1,007 24-Aug-2023, 03:28 PM
Last Post: agent_kith
  Amazon prime hd and ultra hd music anewmission 3 1,013 04-Nov-2021, 01:00 PM
Last Post: Snoopy8
  Request For Comments: Snakeoil 1.2.0 (Gear Isolation) agent_kith 103 33,506 02-May-2021, 09:14 PM
Last Post: agent_kith
  Amazon music anewmission 1 1,000 06-Dec-2020, 08:34 AM
Last Post: hkphantomgtr



Users browsing this thread:
1 Guest(s)

[-]
Our Sponsors

[-]
Welcome
You have to register before you can post on our site.

Username/Email:


Password:





[-]
Latest Threads
Can snakeoil os be installed on Ubuntu 2...
Last Post: clark8888
17-Jul-2024 12:42 PM
» Replies: 21
» Views: 837
Openssh vulnerability is fixed in Mantic
Last Post: patricia1066
17-Jul-2024 02:56 AM
» Replies: 0
» Views: 19
install Snakeoil on Audio Alchemy DMP-1 ...
Last Post: Snoopy8
13-Jul-2024 09:13 PM
» Replies: 1
» Views: 34
Installation problem
Last Post: Snoopy8
09-Jul-2024 12:21 PM
» Replies: 25
» Views: 5896
Something seriously wrong with Squeezeli...
Last Post: Snoopy8
01-Jul-2024 09:22 AM
» Replies: 11
» Views: 486
[split] Real Time Kernels discussion
Last Post: Snoopy8
01-Jul-2024 06:46 AM
» Replies: 42
» Views: 5800
Portable Snakeoil :-) First test.
Last Post: Snoopy8
30-Jun-2024 06:26 PM
» Replies: 26
» Views: 3816
Snakeoil virtualized (PROXMOX), USB+PCI ...
Last Post: agent_kith
25-Jun-2024 02:38 PM
» Replies: 3
» Views: 148
Announcing Snakeoil Measurements 1.3.0
Last Post: Snoopy8
22-Jun-2024 07:22 AM
» Replies: 98
» Views: 7475
CamillaDSP for Room Correction
Last Post: Snoopy8
17-Jun-2024 08:35 PM
» Replies: 26
» Views: 7113

[-]
SnakeoilOS Mission Statement

Our mission is to create a free to use computer OS that is easy to install, intuitive to operate and play music that will connect and engage with you emotionally.

SnakeoilOS gives you the freedom to spend more time on listening, enjoying and exploring music. Wasting time on computers is now a thing of the past! Everything is constantly evolving/improving. Please check back often for updates.

If you like this project, do show your support with a small token donation. All donations collected will be used to run this website, and for purchasing new equipment for the project.


Powered By MyBB, © 2002-2024. Theme © Melroy van den Berg.